| Estarh | 2011-10-26 10:06:15 |
Version 1.22 is released.
| Estarh | 2011-10-26 10:06:46 |
Game loading time was reduced and some minor bugs were fixed.
Here are changes of cards:
Bargul has 24 life now (was 23 life).
Dragon has 41 life now (was 42 life).
Giant Turtle has 17 life now (was 18 life).
Wrath of God has new spell effect now. It deals 12 damage to opponent's creatures and
then increases caster's holy power by 1 for each opponent's creature survived this spell.
Cannonade deals 19 damage now (was 18 damage).
Mindstealer has 36 life now (was 35 life).
Scrambled Lemure has 8 life now (was 9 life).
Mana Burn reduces opponent's mana by 2 now (was reducing by 3).
Death Falcon has 43 life now (was 42 life).
White Elephant has 44 life now (was 45 life).
Rescue operation heals 5 life now (was 4 life).
Bee Queen has 15 life now (was 16 life).
| Jeronimo | 2011-10-26 10:21:44 |
I agree with a few changes. I regret most aren't "game-changing". I expected more from this new upload.
Modified by Jeronimo on 2011-10-26 10:25:56 | HobinHood | 2011-10-26 10:29:26 |
jeronimo yes, I also expected more of this upload, and I do not agree with some changes, but do WHAT right?
| damon5 | 2011-10-26 10:50:56 |
well, i downloaded the new version, and now i can't play WHY?
| Cooler | 2011-10-26 10:55:21 |
well, i downloaded the new version, and now i can't play WHY?
Why can't you play?
| JackAce | 2011-10-26 10:57:24 |
My game also wont restart after I installed the new version. It turned off and whenever i try to start it it crashes.
It's giving the following error:
runtime error 217 at 0053F90E
What to do?
| Cooler | 2011-10-26 11:10:19 |
It's giving the following error: runtime error 217 at 0053F90E What to do?
Did you downloaded the game or auto-updated it? In 1-st case - what was the download link? In 2-nd case what was the previous version?
| damon5 | 2011-10-26 11:15:52 |
I start the game and then a message appears, and said: that the new version was there, if i wanted to install and i say yes, and then start to download, and install,
and when i go to play, there appears a message runtime error 217 at 0053F90E, i uninstall and reinstall and the problem persists. i wait u could help me thanx
Did both - auto-updated it first, then uninstalled and tried again. previous version was whatever I was playing an hour ago online. :)
| damon5 | 2011-10-26 11:16:54 |
i couldn't play
| vvjacobo | 2011-10-26 11:55:13 |
I have the same problem, uninstaling and instaling again new version doesn't fix the problem. I have windows 7. Plz post exacly how to fix the problem
| NightsChild | 2011-10-26 12:43:36 |
I auto-updated, and everything worked fine...
| HobinHood | 2011-10-26 12:47:11 |
here its ok too
| Cooler | 2011-10-26 12:53:17 |
I start the game and then a message appears, and said: that the new version was there, if i wanted to install and i say yes, and then start to download, and install, and when i go to play, there appears a message runtime error 217 at 0053F90E, i uninstall and reinstall and the problem persists. i wait u could help me thanx Did you installed to new (clean) folder? What is your Windows version?
| Wavelength | 2011-10-26 13:04:49 |
Bargul has 24 life now (was 23 life).Dragon has 41 life now (was 42 life). Cannonade deals 19 damage now (was 18 damage). Death Falcon has 43 life now (was 42 life). White Elephant has 44 life now (was 45 life). I like these changes. For Dragon and Cannonade, you should have gone further. Mana Burn reduces opponent's mana by 2 now (was reducing by 3).
I really hope this gets reverted. Yes, Mana Burn is powerful, possibly overpowered. But tactical mana reduction (Mana Burn, Power Chains) is so rare in Spectromancer, and it's a great concept. 2 isn't enough. I'd much rather see Mana Burn increased in cost with a higher mana reduction, or simply have stated that "This damage cannot be improved" (to reduce the OP aspect of Sorcery + Dragon). Wrath of God has new spell effect now. It deals 12 damage to opponent's creatures and
then increases caster's holy power by 1 for each opponent's creature survived this spell. I like that this card got reworked (its mechanic was a little bizarre), and I haven't played the new version yet, but I imagine this will be played in similar full-board situations to Army of Rats. I fear it's a lot worse than Army of Rats. And then again, any nerf to the sickeningly overpowered Holy class is welcome by me. Bee Queen has 15 life now (was 16 life). Is this supposed to be a nerf or a buff? I think you just made the card stronger overall. Giant Turtle has 17 life now (was 18 life). This is a little surprising; was Turtle's win rate really that good? | vvjacobo | 2011-10-26 13:09:52 |
... Did you installed to new (clean) folder? What is your Windows version?
I uninstalled completly and installed again completly, still crashes with shit 217 error. Windows 7
| Joydan | 2011-10-26 13:32:52 |
the Windows Mode at 1366*768 isn't correctly as before
| HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-26 13:40:41 |
I range from OK with to happy about all these changes. I still wish cannonade could go back to its full 20 though!
Wrath of god nerf is interesting but I'm surprised it was that and not divine intervention.
It would be fun to double-sweep with this spell if you can hit 6 creatures with it that aren't killed! | Lauchan | 2011-10-26 13:44:10 |
I updated the game from the auto-update and I didn't have any problems playing the game afterwards... As for the changes, they are pretty conservative with their updates eh aren't they! I like them all though, Only Mindstealer and Bee Queen I don't really understand... Mindstealer needed to be stronger? And although I understand that a dead Bee Queen is sometimes better than a living one, I don't think it needed to be "nerfed"...
the changes seem very good at first glance i trust in the developers anyway, just see what a great job they've done already :) personally, i fully agree with everything (including the reluctance to do drastic changes), except the death falcon buff (already seemed quite good to me, maybe it's because of my playing style) can't wait to see the new wrath in action :) the old one was very restricting to play against, usually even worse than death5 (which needs a creature to be sacrificed) and death7 (which clears the opponent's board as well)
Modified by filip on 2011-10-26 14:14:49 | LordPaul | 2011-10-26 14:20:08 |
This didn't even seem worth the effort to upload or download. Increase/Decreasing a small few cards by one?
| HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-26 14:24:01 |
This didn't even seem worth the effort to upload or download. Increase/Decreasing a small few cards by one? makes a big difference.
I am also having problems playing after installing the update. I get the same error message that has already been posted. I upgraded with the installer on the downloads page because trying to update from in-game wasn't working (I think this was just windows being stupid in the first case). | alouete | 2011-10-26 14:31:25 |
Same error: Runtime Error 217 at 0053F90E I have Windows 7 | NightsChild | 2011-10-26 14:59:21 |
Bargul has 24 life now (was 23 life).
Good
Dragon has 41 life now (was 42 life).
Should be generally nerfed
Giant Turtle has 17 life now (was 18 life).
Ok
Wrath of God has new spell effect now. It deals 12 damage to opponent's creatures and
then increases caster's holy power by 1 for each opponent's creature survived this spell.
Hm...
Not sure yet...
Cannonade deals 19 damage now (was 18 damage).
Should be increased to 20, but banned with Dragon.
Mindstealer has 36 life now (was 35 life).
Bad
Scrambled Lemure has 8 life now (was 9 life).
Unnecessary
Mana Burn reduces opponent's mana by 2 now (was reducing by 3).
Bad. See Wavelenghts Suggestion (Damage cannot be improved)
Death Falcon has 43 life now (was 42 life).
Unnecessary
White Elephant has 44 life now (was 45 life).
Good. Should be nerfed further
Rescue operation heals 5 life now (was 4 life).
Unnecessary
Bee Queen has 15 life now (was 16 life).
Unnecessary
Generally, im not very happy with this Update. I disagreee with many Changes, and am missing the really important Changes...
Modified by NightsChild on 2011-10-26 15:04:25 | vvjacobo | 2011-10-26 15:04:24 |
How is the Runtime Error 217 error doing? Can y hope for a quick fix?
If you need a tester that has the problem i can help for free...
| HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-26 15:08:53 |
I am sure they are working on it. Just be patient.
| Cooler | 2011-10-26 15:14:15 |
How is the Runtime Error 217 error doing? Can y hope for a quick fix?
If you need a tester that has the problem i can help for free...
Yes, this would be very helpful. I sent you an email. Thanks for help!
Upd: Sorry, can't reach you by email - access denied. Could you contact me at support@spectromancer.com Modified by Cooler on 2011-10-26 15:21:48 | vvjacobo | 2011-10-26 15:39:37 |
... Yes, this would be very helpful. I sent you an email. Thanks for help!Upd: Sorry, can't reach you by email - access denied. Could you contact me at support@spectromancer.com
ok i just mailed
| FootairCOM | 2011-10-26 15:48:23 |
"Runtime ERROR" solution: Right click on Spectromancer -"Run as adminstrator"! i have a W7, and it solved the problem!!  | vvjacobo | 2011-10-26 15:51:08 |
"Runtime ERROR" solution:
Right click on Spectromancer -"Run as adminstrator"! i have a W7, and it solved the problem!! Confirmed, its works like this
| HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-26 16:00:24 |
"Runtime ERROR" solution:
Right click on Spectromancer -"Run as adminstrator"! i have a W7, and it solved the problem!! Cool, worked for me too. | noctole | 2011-10-26 16:46:54 |
maaaaan youre a genious!!! thx a lot"Runtime ERROR" solution:
Right click on Spectromancer -"Run as adminstrator"! i have a W7, and it solved the problem!!
| Estarh | 2011-10-26 16:54:57 |
Bee Queen has 15 life now (was 16 life).
Is this supposed to be a nerf or a buff? I think you just made the card stronger overall.
It is planned as tiny nerf.
was Turtle's win rate really that good?
Yes.
| HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-26 17:06:08 |
I can sort of see how turtle is that good. It is cheaper than pretty much everything that actually counters it.
| nedmuss | 2011-10-26 17:30:51 |
I was getting the runtime error, so I uninstalled and reinstalled. This didn't work but the run as admin did work. Unfortunately, now I can play only the free version of the game.... I dont have my old activation code from almost a year ago... Help?
| soldat12 | 2011-10-26 19:33:41 |
overly good redaction, especially turtle. that was just good enough (1 less turn waiting for the Armageddon now) ahgree with others that dragon should have nerfed more. as for the holy, I feel terribly sad for thm for soem reasons (though, I always hate to play against holy just cause of this excact spell). So fix damage at 12 was very good, but effect is really confusing. I don't like effect at all, it's super boring as to me.; not only for class, but into the game overly (they already has monk, angel, now that one spell)
not sure if bee queen really was required for nerf. I'd better give it a buff (like +1 to damage for one of the bee or something) Sad that goblin 1 not fixed by 1hp and air1 didnt buffed Modified by soldat12 on 2011-10-26 19:35:03 | Traconis | 2011-10-26 19:35:39 |
played at work on win 7 pro - no problems played at home - win 7 home - runtime error as above so I switched to admin mode game started - but I lost all the settings as well as activations?! Can't play full game without activating expansions as well as an original game :( looks like there is a problem with security settings under windows 7 home premium :(
Modified by Traconis on 2011-10-26 19:36:45 | Cooler | 2011-10-26 19:59:36 |
I finally discovered the problem and going to fix it soon.
| Wavelength | 2011-10-26 20:10:47 |
Bee Queen: I'm not entirely sure this is going to be a nerf. You want her (and her bees) to attack a few times, then die, for maximum damage at maximum speed. I fear that this just makes that easier to do. I guess we'll find out soon enough.
Giant Turtle: I'm surprised the winrate on this one was so high, but numbers don't lie. If it was a highly-winning card, it probably did need this slight nerf.
The two biggest omissions for me were a lowering of Goblin Hero's attack to 2, and a complete rework of Master Lich.
Can I ask about Timeweaver? What does its winrate look like, against Time as a whole? Everyone complains about Time Stop and Chrono Engine, but I personally think Timeweaver is this class' ace in the hole. :-)
| damon5 | 2011-10-26 20:22:28 |
I finally discovered the problem and going to fix it soon. hi again, i've back from work, and i hope u could fix it, thx for the attention, :)
| porc epic | 2011-10-26 20:35:26 |
doesnt work waitng for the fix
| damon5 | 2011-10-26 21:06:05 |
well, i switched to admin mode, the game works, but i can't write my activation code, because, there is 2 or 3 letters that i can't type!!!
| Wavelength | 2011-10-26 21:40:49 |
well, i switched to admin mode, the game works, but i can't write my activation code, because, there is 2 or 3 letters that i can't type!!! You should be able to copy/paste it in directly, I think, rather than needing to type it. You can also change your computer's Regional/Language Settings to English-US, in which case I imagine you would be able to type all the letters there.
| WillDragonPT | 2011-10-26 23:32:02 |
Hi! The 1st time I've tried to connect to the server, it appeared that version mismatch window. So, I've updated version from 1.21 (bought) to 1.22. After restart of the game, it loaded (very fast) but now I can't connect to the server. I have Windows XP. Why can't I connect??? Is the server down? The color of the letter "O" in spetrOmancer is red. I've tried to ping server.sepctromancer.com and nothing happens but that doens't give me any conclusion since server can be protected against pings. Modified by WillDragonPT on 2011-10-26 23:40:48 | Jeronimo | 2011-10-27 01:54:45 |
I agree with NightsChild observations about this release.
It's just that we were waiting for some Death/Time cards rework, not things like "Holy 6" -> not a priority. Does anyone remember who suggested Death 5 to be capped at 28 dmg? This was really welcome.
Analyzing the balance... Why most changes are about +1 or -1 HP?
Bargul: Instead of that +1 hp, I prefer x1000 that he would make 4 dmg to all creatures when is killed, sort of a mini Demon Lord (the old removed Death 8). It would make people think more.
Wrath of God: As soldat12 said, its new mechanics are tiresome, its just another "Hellfire" (Demon 6). Now, the uniqueness of "doing damage according Opponents's field" is not seen in any Spectromancer card.
New mechanics are far more interesting. Tons of different effects (not repeated) make the game richer in tactical planning ... Next releases should aim to achieve that goal.
By the way, everyone wants to see those Winning Rates of every card. Modified by Jeronimo on 2011-10-27 02:08:41 | crookfield | 2011-10-27 02:48:15 |
running as admin worked for me - but i need my code to re-activate the other classes, I no longer have the email are there any solutions that do not require a re-purchase?
| NightsChild | 2011-10-27 08:07:34 |
I really think the Devs should not calculate the Strenght of Cards by Winning-Rates (alone), but play the Game themselves and watch Replays! Regulairly! The true Strenght of a Card lies in its tactical and situational Play, and Cards that are easy to handle (like Turtle) will automatically have higher Win-Rates than complex Cards (like Mind Master), as there are far more Noobs than Pros... And by the Way: Please do the Bug-Fixing-Discussion in the Bug-Section, so we can talk about the new Version in this Thread...
Modified by NightsChild on 2011-10-27 08:13:13 | Jeronimo | 2011-10-27 09:15:25 |
The true Strenght of a Card lies in its tactical and situational Play, and Cards that are easy to handle (like Turtle) will automatically have higher Win-Rates than complex Cards (like Mind Master), as there are far more Noobs than Pros...
You speak with the light of truth. 
I bet most of those winning rates are based in <10 level players.
I honestly found the Giant Turtle change as "bad". I will prefer to skip it and get W9 or W10. Mindstealer is understimated: He is much like a slow Tornado and Hydra/Cloud blocker.
| damon5 | 2011-10-27 10:48:50 |
WELL, THE THING IS THAT I SWITCH TO ADMIN MODE AND IT WORKS. BUT THERE
IS LETTERS OF MY ACTIVATION CODE, THAT I CAN`T TYPE, AND I TRIED IT
CHANGING THE LANGUAGE BUT NOTHING, (Q, N , Y AND OTHERS DOESN'T TYPE)
THX
guys, don't underestime the devs...
they have the data. do you think they cannot obtain stats from a certain level range? like stats from levels greater than 10 for example?
they sure can. and they sure do.
that being said, i agree that winning rates should not be the only criterion about making changes.
as for turtle, you miss the point entirely. turtle is not an active card, it's a reactive card. so in order to judge its effectiveness, you have to see how good it is in countering certain strategies. if your opponent plays in a specific way, you can punish him/her by using the turtle. that is a healthy thing for the game's balance but it should not have an overwhelming success rate. the opponent needs to have some room to work around the turtle counter. also, sometimes it can also be used as a threat inside an agressive game plan (when you know the opponent is counting on low damage mass destruction, and doesn't have stone rain for example) and then it can be very effective as well, but that's rarer. even then, it is probably better for the opponent to be able to kill it slightly earlier (with armageddon for example). Modified by filip on 2011-10-27 10:53:46 | Cooler | 2011-10-27 12:13:48 |
Problem solved! Installation packages are updated.Sorry for inconvenience! | Cooler | 2011-10-27 12:15:39 |
WELL, THE THING IS THAT I SWITCH TO ADMIN MODE AND IT WORKS. BUT THERE IS LETTERS OF MY ACTIVATION CODE, THAT I CAN`T TYPE, AND I TRIED IT CHANGING THE LANGUAGE BUT NOTHING, (Q, N , Y AND OTHERS DOESN'T TYPE) THX Activation code contains only digits and letters A--F. It can't contain letters Q, N etc.
| NightsChild | 2011-10-27 12:16:33 |
It doesnt matter what Stats they (the Devs) use-
it will never be same as the Experience of a skilled Player.
And as for Turtle, i disagree with you as well:
Turtle can be used as a reactive Card, but as an active Card as well. Its a nice rush Card and Finisher in Combination with Water 8 or Armageddon.
I would even go so far to say, that Turtle is wasted as an reactive Card. 7 Mana just to block a Slot is just too much.
If you have to use it that Way, you usually did something wrong.
Generally, i cant see why Turtle should have been so overpowered. I have played Guys of all Lv, and never had much Problems with this Cards...
There are other Cards, that havent been balanced, that really made me worry...
| Wavelength | 2011-10-27 12:36:22 |
they have the data. do you think they cannot obtain stats from a certain level range? like stats from levels greater than 10 for example? they sure can. and they sure do. Just wanted to add that the devs DO have the breakdown of win rates at different levels. I imagine they consider all levels but bias towards the higher levels. Turtle can be used as a reactive Card, but as an active Card as well. Its a nice rush Card and Finisher in Combination with Water 8 or Armageddon.
In the extremely rare case you have both Water 7 and Water 8, it's usually not a good strategy to play one right after the other. It's risky to play Turtle in an open slot, except maybe very early in the game, because it has a lot of expensive, soft counters. | NightsChild | 2011-10-27 14:01:50 |
It's risky to play Turtle in an open slot, except maybe very early in the game, because it has a lot of expensive, soft counters. Thought you would know better... Playing Turtle in an empty Slot is an excellent Move if you have Board Control and want to expend it, without losing it to Board Clears... And, as i mentioned before, its a nice rush Card... But, it doesnt matter anyway. The Devs have their Stats, and will always use them to balance the Game. In my Eyes, thats unprofessional, as well as the general Game-Mechanics, but nothing will ever change, so why discuss about it... Im disappointed of the Way the Game took, Devs, im disappointed that you didnt listen to the Community when you should have, and i regret the Time i spent trying to improve this Game... Modified by NightsChild on 2011-10-27 14:04:17 | some1one | 2011-10-27 15:22:28 |
wow, thats some serious trolling
| HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-27 16:23:40 |
It doesnt matter what Stats they (the Devs) use-
it will never be same as the Experience of a skilled Player.
1. You're wrong. They have access to the results achieved by all the players including those most skilled. Actual results are always a far better tool for analysis than speculation, even on the part of someone who's mastered the game. Any one person's experience is limited, and slanted by their own view of the game. Results taken all together are completely objective.
2. filip and wavelength are both stronger players than you and you apparently do not trust their analyses of turtle, so you're contradicting your own argument.
| Wavelength | 2011-10-27 16:25:57 |
Thought you would know better...
Playing Turtle in an empty Slot is an excellent Move if you have Board Control and want to expend it, without losing it to Board Clears...
And, as i mentioned before, its a nice rush Card...
Master Healer. Hydra. Earth Elemental. Titan. Dragon. Bee Queen. Three-Headed Demon. Wall of Lightnings. Forest Sprite. Demon Quartermaster. Angel. Are you sure you want to play Turtle in an open slot late in the game? But, it doesnt matter anyway.
The Devs have their Stats, and will always use them to balance the Game.
In my Eyes, thats unprofessional, as well as the general Game-Mechanics, but nothing will ever change, so why discuss about it...
Im disappointed of the Way the Game took, Devs, im disappointed that you didnt listen to the Community when you should have, and i regret the Time i spent trying to improve this Game... I hope they are listening to the community. I don't know how much influence that has, versus winrates, which are obviously helpful but very flawed, especially for Special House cards. I think Turtle is actually a good example where if the winrate is high (for players 15+), you do have to nerf the guy a bit. Because he prevents you from receiving pretty good cards in Ice Guard and Acidic Rain, so that might lower his winrate to begin with. | HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-27 16:35:59 |
Im disappointed of the Way the Game took, Devs, im disappointed that you didnt listen to the Community when you should have, and i regret the Time i spent trying to improve this Game...
regarding this, I think it's quite absurd that you would suggest they haven't listened to "the community" because YOU don't like the changes. You might notice if you look around for a moment than plenty of others have no problem with these changes. Nobody here elected you our spokesperson, so how about you let us all decide for ourselves whether we think we're being listened to?
If it really weighs so heavily on your soul that you've wasted immense portions of your life on spectromancer activism, perhaps you should try something more productive than posting dramatically about minor updates on the forums. You don't even play the game, so why on earth do you care? | Wavelength | 2011-10-27 19:34:20 |
I'm pretty torn because while I usually feel like the devs really do listen to the player base (Draft tourneys? 1P deck building? Observer mode? JPGs? Installation bugs? They really are on top of this stuff), there have been a few cards that most people feel make the game very un-fun (like Master Lich and Time Stop) that they not only don't change, but also don't address.
But I think it's worth giving any team that can create such a good game the benefit of the doubt.
| damon5 | 2011-10-27 20:21:02 |
... Activation code contains only digits and letters A--F. It can't contain letters Q, N etc.
sorry, but my activation code, has q
| damon5 | 2011-10-27 20:21:51 |
... Activation code contains only digits and letters A--F. It can't contain letters Q, N etc.
sorry , butmy activation code, has q, n, and y, and numbers
| Wavelength | 2011-10-27 20:25:42 |
... sorry , butmy activation code, has q, n, and y, and numbers
That's weird. I just checked one of my old activation codes and it was all digits and A-F.
| bZanno | 2011-10-27 21:17:38 |
let's make all the right changes without actually changing anything
shuffling 1 hp on a glass cannon like the berserker is going to have more effect than shuffling 1 hp on a dragon
this is likely the third patch in a row now, where the devs are correctly identifying the symptoms, but not the causes
mindstealer is perhaps the most enlightening change - it's winrate isnt low because its too weak, it just appears low because giant is and always has been overpowered
| some1one | 2011-10-27 21:27:37 |
I think they probably changed Wrath of God because it hard counters the Forest class as a whole. It has been said by some strong players that the biggest counter to the class is the local sweep. As the power of the card scales with the number of creatures it makes it even stronger against a class that usually has more creatures on the board.
The new card seems to be designed around that, since it will not trigger the power increase against most of the creatures of this class, while Forest6 will actually reduce the power of the spell now.
Jeronimo: "Now, the uniqueness of "doing damage according Opponents's field" is not seen in any Spectromancer card."
If a new card with this type of mechanic will return it should be in a class that is mostly weak against the Mad Hermit class as a whole, imo, since the card will probably hard counter the class as Wrath of God did. | HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-27 23:00:12 |
I like the change to wrath because for one thing I felt the spell was a little too strong anyway, but for another, I actually never liked the mechanic it was based on in the first place. Jeronimo is right that this mechanic no longer exists but I think it was not such a great one because it is kind of contrary to the basic idea of the game (which is probably why the spell was so strong, in fact.)
Also, I'd just like to mention that the boosted loading time makes quite a difference when starting spectro on my little netbook, so thanks to the devs for that. Little touch but a nice one. :) | HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-27 23:25:27 |
today I've gotten the mysterious "you cheated!" message twice for no apparent reason. could it be related to the new version somehow? I don't recall that particular error ever affecting me.
| crookfield | 2011-10-28 13:14:49 |
PLEASE // WHY do I need to re-enter my activation code, does it not have a record the I previously owned the game?
| Cooler | 2011-10-28 14:05:38 |
today I've gotten the mysterious "you cheated!" message twice for no apparent reason. could it be related to the new version somehow? I don't recall that particular error ever affecting me. Could you send your "lookup.dat" file to support?
| Cooler | 2011-10-28 14:06:24 |
PLEASE // WHY do I need to re-enter my activation code, does it not have a record the I previously owned the game? You don't have to re-enter the code if you install new version over previous one.
| crookfield | 2011-10-28 15:19:40 |
uhhg but if i uninstall now, and re-instal it will no longer have the previous version to go over?
| CaptainAmerica | 2011-10-28 16:15:53 |
I'm afraid to upgrade because the game might not work like some people are saying. I figure I'll just wait until they fix all the bugs...
Can I still play online against someone who upgraded and I didn't?
| Cooler | 2011-10-28 16:51:24 |
I'm afraid to upgrade because the game might not work like some people are saying. I figure I'll just wait until they fix all the bugs...
Can I still play online against someone who upgraded and I didn't?
You can install another instance (in another folder) and try if it works.
| HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-28 20:52:05 |
... Could you send your "lookup.dat" file to support?
I actually did solve the problem by reinstalling the game after the fix, but I don't think it was related to the error everyone was posting about in this thread as I realized there was an issue with the install itself. Unfortunately having already reinstalled I don't have the file to send anymore. | HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-28 20:52:49 |
I'm afraid to upgrade because the game might not work like some people are saying. I figure I'll just wait until they fix all the bugs...
Can I still play online against someone who upgraded and I didn't?
I'm pretty sure nobody has had any problems at all since using the fix Cooler posted. You should be fine. | Lankaras | 2011-10-29 11:43:29 |
Fullscreen scaling issues are worse than before. I used to only have the disappearing cards (while a card was scaling/zooming) and a minor interface glitch in the lobby. Now the whole menu screen is messed up. On 1024x768 everything is fine.
| wiggin | 2011-10-29 15:06:35 |
...
I like these changes. For Dragon and Cannonade, you should have gone further.
...
I really hope this gets reverted. Yes, Mana Burn is powerful, possibly overpowered. But tactical mana reduction (Mana Burn, Power Chains) is so rare in Spectromancer, and it's a great concept. 2 isn't enough. I'd much rather see Mana Burn increased in cost with a higher mana reduction, or simply have stated that "This damage cannot be improved" (to reduce the OP aspect of Sorcery + Dragon).
...
I like that this card got reworked (its mechanic was a little bizarre), and I haven't played the new version yet, but I imagine this will be played in similar full-board situations to Army of Rats. I fear it's a lot worse than Army of Rats. And then again, any nerf to the sickeningly overpowered Holy class is welcome by me.
...
Is this supposed to be a nerf or a buff? I think you just made the card stronger overall.
...
This is a little surprising; was Turtle's win rate really that good?
I agree with all this, except that I'm not surprised about Turtle's win rate. That card is extremely tough for its price, and a major reason that some people say that water mana is worth more than the others. I also agree that I would've preferred another effect change in mana burn if possible, and that its not obvious that the change to Queen Bee will be as intended.
Also, I think that the devs don't know what they are doing with Goblin. First they buffed the already too strong Goblin Hero. Now with the 0-1 pair being understandibly skewed towards the hero, they buff the 0 too. Instead of buffing the class' strongest card, they should've looked at some of the others, and the class' overall weaknesses. | Estarh | 2011-10-29 21:20:17 |
.Also, I think that the devs don't know what they are doing with Goblin. First they buffed the already too strong Goblin Hero. Now with the 0-1 pair being understandibly skewed towards the hero, they buff the 0 too. Instead of buffing the class' strongest card, they should've looked at some of the others, and the class' overall weaknesses. Rescue operation had lowest winrate in the game. It is quite strange to keep weakest card without changes.
So, now we have heard quite a few high level players give their opinions about the changes. Could we hope that the devs too would share their thoughts about why they have chosen to make exactly these changes, and maybe why they chose not to change some of the other cards? I think that would be very interesting and informative, and that it would answer a lot of the questions and doubts from the players :)
| Lauchan | 2011-10-29 22:06:40 |
... Rescue operation had lowest winrate in the game. It is quite strange to keep weakest card without changes.
What is exactly a "winrate" ? | Estarh | 2011-10-29 22:47:32 |
Could we hope that the devs too would share their thoughts about why they have chosen to make exactly these changes, and maybe why they chose not to change some of the other cards? I think that would be very interesting and informative, and that it would answer a lot of the questions and doubts from the players :)
Bargul, Cannonade, Mindstealer, Death Falcon and Rescue Operation were buffed since they were too weak (according win rates and usage rates, at different levels).
Dragon, Giant Turtle, Lemure, Mana Burn, White Elephant and Bee Queen were nerfed since they were too strong. I agree with things Wavelength wrote about Mana burn and most probably this spell will be changed again in next version.
Wrath of God was nerfed since it was too uncomfortable to play against it, and since too many players played as clerics.
Blood Ritual was not nerfed since I forgot to do it.
Other cards were not changed since they (except Master Lich) are ok from my point of view. Master Lich will be reworked in next expansion.
| Estarh | 2011-10-29 23:14:31 |
... What is exactly a "winrate" ?
Winrate of card is "amount of duels players win with this card in their hand" divided by "amount of duels players play with this card in their hand". Winrate of average card is 50%.
Best winrate was winrate of Mana Burn (54,7%, according duels during last 6 weeks).
Worst winrate was winrate of Rescue operation (45,8%).
Usage rate of card is "amount of duels players use this card at least 1 time" divided by "amount of duels players play with this card in their hand".
Best usage rate was usage rate of Merfolk Elder (69%).
Worst usage rate was usage rate of Astral Guard (15%).
| Lauchan | 2011-10-29 23:18:59 |
Thank you. These are definitely two relevant stats to keep in mind when updating.
...
Bargul, Cannonade, Mindstealer, Death Falcon and Rescue Operation were buffed since they were too weak (according win rates and usage rates, at different levels).
Dragon, Giant Turtle, Lemure, Mana Burn, White Elephant and Bee Queen were nerfed since they were too strong. I agree with things Wavelength wrote about Mana burn and most probably this spell will be changed again in next version.
Wrath of God was nerfed since it was too uncomfortable to play against it, and since too many players played as clerics.
Blood Ritual was not nerfed since I forgot to do it.
Other cards were not changed since they (except Master Lich) are ok from my point of view. Master Lich will be reworked in next expansion. Thank you very much. That was indeed very informative :)
Is winrate data publicly available? Also, can the winrate data be sorted by player skill? It would be interesting to see which cards get stronger as player skill goes up.
| XehutL | 2011-10-30 00:30:24 |
And what about exchanging the Paladin with the Monk (and their lives as well)? I think the Paladin is quite overused in plays while in comparisn the computer AI almost don't use the Monk (I've seen it very rarely - but I don't know the online play, however)...
IMO the Paladin seems more like a lv2 creature while Monk could be a nice lvl1 pick to force the opponent to a certain play... but it would still need to decrease the Monk's killing reward to 1 Holy probably.
| HeadphonesGirl | 2011-10-30 02:53:50 |
Thanks for those posts Estarh. It's always nice to hear from you guys what you are thinking.
I'm not surprised there are some things still to be changed. This update seemed to me like a pretty minor one that wouldn't have involved a lot of major reworks (usually those only happen with expansions). | Wavelength | 2011-10-30 03:17:43 |
Bargul, Cannonade, Mindstealer, Death Falcon and Rescue Operation were buffed since they were too weak (according win rates and usage rates, at different levels). Dragon, Giant Turtle, Lemure, Mana Burn, White Elephant and Bee Queen were nerfed since they were too strong. I agree with things Wavelength wrote about Mana burn and most probably this spell will be changed again in next version. Wrath of God was nerfed since it was too uncomfortable to play against it, and since too many players played as clerics. Blood Ritual was not nerfed since I forgot to do it. Other cards were not changed since they (except Master Lich) are ok from my point of view. Master Lich will be reworked in next expansion. So, I'm really happy right now, not only because it already sounds like a few great changes are slated for the next version, but also because it is an amazing feeling to know that my feedback may help the game. So first of all, just want to say thank you. The rework to Master Lich is the best news of all - this is an unbelievably frustrating card to play against, and I will be glad to see him go. I hope that the rework of the card doesn't have any "permanent" effects that last the entire game. I'm also happy to hear about the nerf to Blood Ritual. Looking forward to the possibility of a different nerf to Mana Burn. I get that the "3 mana" was the only real number on the card that can be lowered, but like I mentioned, it would be a real shame to lose the mana suppression part of this spell. It would definitely be a decent nerf (against the 1.21 version) to make it the Sorcery 7 with a mana loss of 4, because it would make the spell slower... and this is just based on my experience, but I really think adding the "damage cannot be improved" clause (with 3 mana loss) would be enough to bring its winrate back in line with the rest of Sorcery - this spell certainly shines most when it can do 18-20 damage because Dragon's on your field. After playing with the change to Wrath of God, I like it - it might need more damage, but the concept is good. Jeronimo showed me a really cool combo where you have a spread attacker (like Lightning Cloud) in play, you use Wrath of God and creatures survive (so you get the bonus mana), and then your spread attacker wipes them out! It's brilliant. Finally, it's got to be tricky territory trying to balance Rescue Operation (sometimes used on foes) and Bee Queen (sometimes you WANT it to die). The Bee Queen "nerf" should be an interesting experiment - keep a close eye on its new winrates!
Modified by Wavelength on 2011-10-30 03:20:10 | Wavelength | 2011-10-30 03:37:48 |
A couple thoughts about other posts in this thread: Also, I think that the devs don't know what they are doing with Goblin. First they buffed the already too strong Goblin Hero. Now with the 0-1 pair being understandibly skewed towards the hero, they buff the 0 too. Instead of buffing the class' strongest card, they should've looked at some of the others, and the class' overall weaknesses. I don't feel as strongly as Wiggin, but I do think he makes a point. The special cards are going to be much harder to balance by winrates/usage alone, because each "pair" of cards is going to have the exact same winrate as the class as a whole.
I'm guessing that the reason Rescue Operation's winrate is so low is because you can't get it with Goblin Hero. My instinct is that Goblin Hero is overpowered and the rest of the class is slightly underpowered - buffing Rescue Operation theoretically reduces draw dependency but wouldn't be the ideal fix for the class if all the higher cards are too weak. Mechanician may have this problem as well, where the higher cards make the lower cards look better than they really are. Just advice from a guy who might or might not know what he's talking about. :-) Best winrate was winrate of Mana Burn (54,7%, according duels during last 6 weeks). Worst winrate was winrate of Rescue operation (45,8%). Best usage rate was usage rate of Merfolk Elder (69%). Worst usage rate was usage rate of Astral Guard (15%).
It's always really interesting to see stats like this! Thanks! It definitely challenges one's perspective of the game. Rescue Operation was the only one I might have guessed correctly (for the record, my other guesses would have been Tornado for highest winrate, Wall of Fire for best usage, and Ancient Horror for worst usage). And what about exchanging the Paladin with the Monk (and their lives as well)? I think the Paladin is quite overused in plays while in comparisn the computer AI almost don't use the Monk (I've seen it very rarely - but I don't know the online play, however)...
IMO the Paladin seems more like a lv2 creature while Monk could be a nice lvl1 pick to force the opponent to a certain play... but it would still need to decrease the Monk's killing reward to 1 Holy probably. This idea was already suggested twice, and has been met with overwhelming dislike by the community. Holy 1 and 2 are great cards for the game as they are right now, and a cheap Paladin-like creature with more than 9 life would be very dangerous to implement because it would laugh at sweeps. | Wavelength | 2011-10-30 03:43:14 |
Ah, one more thing :-)
The card text on this forum still needs to be updated per the 1.22 changes.
P.S. - The faster Spectromancer loading speed is simply awesome.
| XehutL | 2011-10-30 07:56:58 |
This idea was already suggested twice, and has been met with overwhelming dislike by the community. Holy 1 and 2 are great cards for the game as they are right now, and a cheap Paladin-like creature with more than 9 life would be very dangerous to implement because it would laugh at sweeps. I don't get this - the Paladin has only one-time summoning effect and as such, more lives doesn't matter here. On the other hand, should it be on the level 2, he will be used less - thus less healing to all units. The Monk with 9 lives and returning its mana after death could be more effective - as it would be eiher short time defender or immediate mana back. I don't see the point why they are great for the game as they are right now... but it could be just me, of course :-) Also for the next future expansion I would be happy to see some alternative spells in each of the 4 basic elements... it will be a lot of work to do and hard job to ballance, but it would be VERY nice to have some fresh interactions again. Or at least, the addition of 0 and 13 cost cards to all elements would be nice..
| wiggin | 2011-10-30 10:36:05 |
I think the Wrath of God nerf will also help the Rescue Operation win rates.
Modified by wiggin on 2011-10-30 10:36:32 | FlawlessTime | 2011-10-30 11:58:20 |
I'm guessing that the reason Rescue Operation's winrate is so low is because you can't get it with Goblin Hero. My instinct is that Goblin Hero is overpowered and the rest of the class is slightly underpowered - buffing Rescue Operation theoretically reduces draw dependency but wouldn't be the ideal fix for the class if all the higher cards are too weak.
Yeah this seems spot on. It's hard to imagine a tier1 card being responsible for a 5percentage point lower winrate, especially when it's a situational utility card.
Do the winrates of the cards of the later tiers get weighted according to the performance of the lower tiers?As an extreme example imagine there was a special class with an "I win the game" card (cost 2) , which has obviously a winrate of 100% and you draw it half the time. The rest of the cards are normal with cost1 card having a winrate of 50%. Then all the later tier cards should have winrates of 75% if they are perfectly balanced, because half the time you win due to the "I win the game" card and you actually only use them in the other half of the games.
Similarly if a class has the combination of both tier1 cards above 50%, you should expect the later tiers to be above 50% as well if they are well-balanced. | Cooler | 2011-11-01 11:46:12 |
Fullscreen issues are fixed now.
| bZanno | 2011-11-02 07:23:00 |
mana burn: at first i thought it
was a bit surprising that it wins the award of "best card in the game",
but on second thought, it makes sense
i think the problem is the card does too many things at once. it does
direct damage, does creature damage, and drains mana. so you had to
attack one of the three, but i think the mana reduction was probably the
least interesting thing to adjust. perhaps you could do something like
remove the direct damage and make it X+2 to creatures or so, pick
whatever number you want, just please dont implement another hard cap
white elephant: white elephant's
win rate is too good because when paired with ice guard, there's a
number of draw that mathematically can't do enough dps to kill the
opponent. master healer is equally troublesome but not as invincible.
it's good you're looking at usage rates but you need to start looking at
two card and perhaps even three card combos after isolating the cards
with aberrant winrates
i'd estimate the winrate of ice guard+master healer+elephant is 80%+
with those 20% of losses being all-ins with berserker and a turn 2 fire
elemental that prevent the strategy from ever gaining traction, but hey,
just because one unbeatable strategy can beat another unbeatable
strategy doesn't make it fair
dragon: this card has probably
been talked about more than any other card on the forum as to why it's
so strong, but i think the reason why is actually quite simple. it
breaks cost effectiveness in one turn whereas the other cards its weight
class, mind master/hydra/etc do it over the course of several turns,
but at the same time, only tornado and a few house cards can hard
counter dragon. so with all that said, what you could do, instead of
"nerf" dragon outright, would be to polarize him even further, by
restoring his beastly 10 atk but lowering his hp to the 29-33 range. by
putting the card just slightly out of reach of the threat index of stone
rain and armageddon, you set it up so that dragon can break even on
cost effectiveness quite easily but won't be able to achieve the insane
cost efficiency it can get right now by flinging an endless barrage of
spells. dragon needs to be viewed more like a slightly slower version of astral guard, where you really need to get it out of play as quickly as possible, but right now only tornado can do that turtle: this is actually purely a draw issue - some hands have no way to kill the turtle. the number of hands that can't kill turtle increases when master healer gets involved. so i'm afraid there's no way to easily tackle this problem, if it actually is one. adjusting its hp too much will only make its winrate very low when it doesn't get a favorable opposing draw. you could easily resolve the problem by changing the draw conditions so you always get at least one elemental (this would actually make almost any hand winnable, and should have been done ages ago)
Modified by bZanno on 2011-11-02 07:35:09
Fullscreen issues are fixed now. thx, however I`m having troubles in the window mode......some of the graphics dont load (properly)....any ideas what to do ?
| Wavelength | 2011-11-02 14:50:16 |
In response to Zanno's ideas:
Mana Burn: I've already said my peace on this one, so I'll just say that I agree it would be smart to not implement a hard cap. Blood Ritual is the only card that really needs a hard cap.
White Elephant: No radical rework necessary. Maybe drop 2 or 3 HP and we're good. And 1 of those HP was already dropped in 1.22.
Dragon: I like your analysis on this one a lot, Zanno. Wiggin has also suggested making the stats more polarized and I have to agree. I also think a spell increase reduction would be fair.
Giant Turtle: Still feels like a nice play at 5/17 so I think that the change may have been perfect. If you're right that the problem is that its power is too draw-dependent on the opponent's hand, it might be a good solution to decrease the damage reduction slightly but increase its HP. I'm not entirely convinced that you're right, though. Hands that have no way to kill it usually have a multitude of ways to play around it.
| bZanno | 2011-11-02 19:29:09 |
White Elephant: No radical rework necessary. Maybe drop 2 or 3 HP and we're good. And 1 of those HP was already dropped in 1.22.
just crunch the numbers dude there are some hands that mathematically cannot do enough dps to kill both a white elephant and ice guard in even if you have all 6 slots full, then come back and tell me it's not broken
| Wavelength | 2011-11-02 19:33:17 |
... just crunch the numbers dude
there are some hands that mathematically cannot do enough dps to kill both a white elephant and ice guard in even if you have all 6 slots full, then come back and tell me it's not broken
What hands are these, and how is it any different from a hand that can't kill elementals (especially with an Archangel in the opponent's hand) or a Master Healer or a Turtle or a Mind Master + Nature Ritual combo? Also, I don't quite understand what you mean by "cannot kill". Eventually, those creatures are going to die unless there's something healing them. In which case we identify Magic Hamster as the real culprit. Maybe it's just that your terminology is off but I'm failing to see how what you're describing is a problem.
Modified by Wavelength on 2011-11-02 19:34:07 | bZanno | 2011-11-02 22:02:14 |
in the amount of time it takes to tear down the ice guard and elephant, another elephant can be summoned immediately this gives you a one turn window to deal damage to the opponent's life, and only via creature damage, not spells. this is not sufficient to ever kill them. so if you have a hand that's reliant on damage spells for the kill strike, you plain can't win. the player with the elephant will eventually stall out getting chipped for a small amount of life every 4 to 6 turns, accumulate a critical mass of mana, and overwhelm the opponent meanwhile, the player trying to tear the elephant down can't stall out and accumulate mana on his own. because the elephant has 8 attack, it demands a strong response. the player fighting elephant-ice guard needs to massively outplay the other guy in order to win, by engineering a timing window where the ice guard and elephant are dead simultaneously. even armageddon hands have trouble doing this, because blowing the elephant away with arma is only cost effective at low fire, and if you do too much damage to your own front line you put yourself in a position where the opponent may be able to overwhelm you normally the easiest tweak to fix this, would be to change the elephant's mechanic to work like wall of refect, where if the elephant only has 12 hp it can only absorb 12 damage, not the entire attack or you can leave the elephant as-is, and ban it with ice guard and maybe master healer too there are two reasons you don't see this strategy as often as you should 1) the
ranking system encourages mass games, so no one likes to play a strategy
that takes 30 mins-1 hour to play out 2) basilisk is pretty good there are a very narrow range of ways to beat this strategy, the two major ones are berserker all-ins and 4x elemental play. but i don't really read too much into that, just because two completely imbalanced strategies are capable of defeating an equally broken hand
Modified by bZanno on 2011-11-02 22:06:49 | wiggin | 2011-11-03 00:53:21 |
there are a very narrow range of ways to beat this strategy, the two major ones are berserker all-ins and 4x elemental play. but i don't really read too much into that, just because two completely imbalanced strategies are capable of defeating an equally broken hand
You can actually play all resource games strategies. Get the upper hand in resources and a comfortable life situation, and it won't matter how much life or how many elephants the opponent has. Berserker rush seems like one of the worst strategies against Elephant - Ice Guard though. | bZanno | 2011-11-03 01:09:27 |
...
You can actually play all resource games strategies. Get the upper hand in resources and a comfortable life situation, and it won't matter how much life or how many elephants the opponent has. Berserker rush seems like one of the worst strategies against Elephant - Ice Guard though.
it works because not only does it leave them with very little life once the strategy gets traction by going for life pressure right away, you may force them to tip ice guard early, which means later on the ice guard won't be protecting the elephant illusion gets its direct damage in full swing during the midgame, whereas chaos gets it direct damage right away the goal of elephant-guard is to stall the game out long enough to get a critical mass of mana, so anything that can force them to spend mana will help you out. berserkers also have two other huge things going for them: 1) they're both one of the fastest and most cost effective ways of directly damaging life in the game 2) they do damage in small increments, so unlike throwing armageddon or lightning bolt at the problem, they don't lose damage via overkill
actually, they lose exactly the same amount of damage, that is, 50% :P
if a berserker would deal 20 damage (in 5 or 6 rounds), then with ice guard he would deal 10 (or a little bit more, see below)
if lightning bolt would deal 20 damage, then with ice guard it would deal 10
the only factor that favors the berserker is that damage gets rounded up, so it is slightly better to deal it in small increments | Wavelength | 2011-11-03 13:26:11 |
Well, Zanno's right in that if the Elephant has, say, 2 HP remaining, you want Berserkers as your damage source rather than Lightning Bolt, if you have to choose one. Elephant will absorb an entire hit until it dies.
Generally I am able to take board control against Elephant hands, and the Elephant only grants an extra couple turns before the pressure's back. There are a few hands I can't do this with, but every good strategy has a couple of hands it would dominate. Generally, I have some way to destroy Ice Guard, which is really the key to victory. (Magic Hamster and Nature Ritual are the most likely ways that I WON'T be able to destroy Ice Guard.) I don't think the Chain Elephants are such a big problem for the game.
I still think Elephant works fine the way it is at 42-43 HP.
| wiggin | 2011-11-03 14:03:24 |
... it works because not only does it leave them with very little life once the strategy gets traction
It might "work" in the sense that I don't doubt that you have won some games in this way. However, by considering the comparative advantage of Berserker, you can see that it is not a good move to use against Ice Guard + Elephant.
This might also be a partial reason as to why you think the card is overpowered, if you often try to rush straight into it. Modified by wiggin on 2011-11-03 14:11:40 | soldat12 | 2011-11-03 19:34:00 |
i must say it takes no sense to have an standing elephant with 1hp and you cast geddon and result nothing
| dincay | 2011-11-04 12:02:22 |
Excuse me but what was the old Wrath of God?
The card list was updated already.
| HeadphonesGirl | 2011-11-04 12:19:14 |
Old wrath did 4 damage for every creature the opponent had in play, and didn't have the mana gain aspect. So, playing against it was almost like having your board slot positions limited, in a way. I like the new mechanic more after playing with and against it. It requires more cleverness to make good use of it now.
Modified by HeadphonesGirl on 2011-11-04 12:19:36 | Wavelength | 2011-11-10 21:06:07 |
Hey, I just had another idea for a possible Mana Burn rework: Reduces the opponent's largest mana power by 4, then deals damage to opponent and opponent's creatures equal to that mana power.So if the opponent's largest mana pool is 13 Fire, it becomes 9 Fire, then the opponent and each of her creatures take 9 damage. This would get around the limitation of having no "numbers" to reduce on the damage end, and would allow Mana Burn to keep (and actually enhance) its most unique trait, which is mana reduction. It would also represent a nerf overall, which apparently would be justified since it's the game's winningest card. Modified by Wavelength on 2011-11-10 21:08:39 | bZanno | 2011-11-11 11:29:02 |
Hey, I just had another idea for a possible Mana Burn rework:
Reduces the opponent's largest mana power by 4, then deals damage to opponent and opponent's creatures equal to that mana power.
So if the opponent's largest mana pool is 13 Fire, it becomes 9 Fire, then the opponent and each of her creatures take 9 damage.
This would get around the limitation of having no "numbers" to reduce on the damage end, and would allow Mana Burn to keep (and actually enhance) its most unique trait, which is mana reduction. It would also represent a nerf overall, which apparently would be justified since it's the game's winningest card. that is actually brilliant we need 1.23 right now
| soldat12 | 2011-11-11 18:03:39 |
that would be super nerf if yo uask me.... well, from other hand... oh gosh.... too hard to balance... Wave, you're bastard, that would be very tricky spell to play. Give me back my goblin1!
| Wavelength | 2012-01-30 06:37:38 |
Hey, I just had another idea for a possible Mana Burn rework:
Reduces the opponent's largest mana power by 4, then deals damage to opponent and opponent's creatures equal to that mana power.
So if the opponent's largest mana pool is 13 Fire, it becomes 9 Fire, then the opponent and each of her creatures take 9 damage.
This would get around the limitation of having no "numbers" to reduce on the damage end, and would allow Mana Burn to keep (and actually enhance) its most unique trait, which is mana reduction. It would also represent a nerf overall, which apparently would be justified since it's the game's winningest card. Or, as another possible change to Mana Burn:
Reduces opponent's highest power by 4, then deals damage to opponent and
all opponent's creatures equal to opponent's highest power.
Therefore, if the opponent's powers were 13-4-5-3-7, it would reduce
Fire to 9 then do 9 damage (just like my previous proposal), but if opponent's powers are 13-11-5-3-7, it
would reduce Fire to 9 and then do 11 damage (as Water becomes the new
highest power).
This might be one way to preserve the mana control aspect without
overpowering the card, if my previous suggestion would make it too weak. (Or, revert it to the way it was with 3 mana reduction, and add that "this damage cannot be improved" to remove its sick synergy with Dragon. I'm guessing that would lower its winrate by enough too.  ) Modified by Wavelength on 2012-01-30 06:46:59 | Wavelength | 2012-02-12 17:06:46 |
I hope I'm not being annoying with all these suggestions, but had a good idea to slightly buff Rescue Operation: "Moves target creature to random empty slot. If the target is your creature, it heals 5HP." This will also make it a lot easier to apply buffs and nerfs, since the healing is no longer a double-edged sword.
Modified by Wavelength on 2012-02-12 17:08:44 | GrimJ0ker | 2012-02-12 17:26:26 |
I also think that should be remade Goblin3 .. if you have no creatures on the board, should not be used | wiggin | 2012-02-12 18:03:30 |
I hope I'm not being annoying with all these suggestions, but had a good idea to slightly buff Rescue Operation:
"Moves target creature to random empty slot. If the target is your creature, it heals 5HP."
This will also make it a lot easier to apply buffs and nerfs, since the healing is no longer a double-edged sword. I like this idea. |
